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Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / AIDS / April 2007

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Denialism

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GMCarter - 10 Apr 2007 17:02 GMT
In any form...same sh.t stinks whether it's Bush and climate changed
caused by humans (and greedy low life bastards like Bush/Cheney) or an
Ahmadinejad denying the Nazi holocaut against Jews, muslims, gays and
lesbians, gypsies, etc. Or fools that want to believe HIV doesn't
cause AIDS.

        George M. Carter

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041007P.shtml
\There Is Climate Change Censorship - and it's the Deniers Who Dish it
Out
   By George Monbiot
   The Guardian UK

   Tuesday 10 April 2007

   Global warming scientists are under intense pressure to water down
findings, and are then accused of silencing their critics.

   The drafting of reports by the world's pre-eminent group of
climate scientists is an odd process. For months scientists
contributing to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change tussle
over the evidence. Nothing gets published unless it achieves
consensus. This means that the panel's reports are conservative - even
timid. It also means that they are as trustworthy as a scientific
document can be.

   Then, when all is settled among the scientists, the politicians
sweep in and seek to excise from the summaries anything that threatens
their interests.

   The scientists fight back, but they always have to make
concessions. The report released on Friday, for example, was shorn of
the warning that "North America is expected to experience locally
severe economic damage, plus substantial ecosystem, social and
cultural disruption from climate change related events".

   This is the opposite of the story endlessly repeated in the
rightwing press: that the IPCC, in collusion with governments, is
conspiring to exaggerate the science. No one explains why governments
should seek to amplify their own failures. In the wacky world of the
climate conspiracists no explanations are required. The world's most
conservative scientific body has somehow been transformed into a
conspiracy of screaming demagogues.

   This is just one aspect of a story that is endlessly told the
wrong way round. In the Sunday Telegraph and the Daily Mail, in
columns by Dominic Lawson, Tom Utley and Janet Daley, the allegation
is repeated that climate scientists and environmentalists are trying
to "shut down debate." Those who say that man-made global warming is
not taking place, they claim, are being censored.

   Something is missing from their accusations: a single valid
example. The closest any of them have been able to get is two letters
sent - by the Royal Society and by the US senators Jay Rockefeller and
Olympia Snowe - to that delicate flower ExxonMobil, asking that it
cease funding lobbyists who deliberately distort climate science.
These correspondents had no power to enforce their wishes. They were
merely urging Exxon to change its practices. If everyone who urges is
a censor, then the comment pages of the newspapers must be closed in
the name of free speech.

   In a recent interview, Martin Durkin, who made Channel 4's film
The Great Global Warming Swindle, claimed he was subject to "invisible
censorship". He seems to have forgotten that he had 90 minutes of
prime-time television to expound his theory that climate change is a
green conspiracy. What did this censorship amount to? Complaints about
one of his programmes had been upheld by the Independent Television
Commission. It found that "the views of the four complainants, as made
clear to the interviewer, had been distorted by selective editing" and
that they had been "misled as to the content and purpose of the
programmes when they agreed to take part". This, apparently, makes him
a martyr.

   If you want to know what real censorship looks like, let me show
you what has been happening on the other side of the fence. Scientists
whose research demonstrates that climate change is taking place have
been repeatedly threatened and silenced and their findings edited or
suppressed.

   The Union of Concerned Scientists found that 58% of the 279
climate scientists working at federal agencies in the US who responded
to its survey reported that they had experienced one of the following
constraints: 1. Pressure to eliminate the words "climate change",
"global warming", or other similar terms from their communications; 2.
Editing of scientific reports by their superiors that "changed the
meaning of scientific findings"; 3. Statements by officials at their
agencies that misrepresented their findings; 4. The disappearance or
unusual delay of websites, reports, or other science-based materials
relating to climate; 5. New or unusual administrative requirements
that impair climate-related work; 6. Situations in which scientists
have actively objected to, resigned from, or removed themselves from a
project because of pressure to change scientific findings. They
reported 435 incidents of political interference over the past five
years.

   In 2003, the White House gutted the climate-change section of a
report by the Environmental Protection Agency. It deleted references
to studies showing that global warming is caused by manmade emissions.
It added a reference to a study, partly funded by the American
Petroleum Institute, that suggested that temperatures are not rising.
Eventually the agency decided to drop the section altogether.

   After Thomas Knutson at the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric
Administration (NOAA) published a paper in 2004 linking rising
emissions with more intense tropical cyclones, he was blocked by his
superiors from speaking to the media. He agreed to one request to
appear on MSNBC, but a public affairs officer at NOAA rang the station
and said that Knutson was "too tired" to conduct the interview. The
official explained to him that the "White House said no". All media
inquiries were to be routed instead to a scientist who believed there
was no connection between global warming and hurricanes.

   Last year Nasa's top climate scientist, James Hansen, reported
that his bosses were trying to censor his lectures, papers and web
postings. He was told by Nasa's PR officials that there would be "dire
consequences" if he continued to call for rapid reductions in
greenhouse gases.

   Last month, the Alaskan branch of the US fish and wildlife service
told its scientists that anyone travelling to the Arctic must
understand "the administration's position on climate change, polar
bears, and sea ice and will not be speaking on or responding to these
issues".

   At hearings in the US Congress three weeks ago, Philip Cooney, a
former White House aide who had previously worked at the American
Petroleum Institute, admitted he had made hundreds of changes to
government reports about climate change on behalf of the Bush
administration. Though not a scientist, he had struck out evidence
that glaciers were retreating and inserted phrases suggesting that
there was serious scientific doubt about global warming.

   The guardians of free speech in Britain aren't above attempting a
little suppression, either. The Guardian and I have now received
several letters from the climate sceptic Viscount Monckton threatening
us with libel proceedings after I challenged his claims about climate
science. On two of these occasions he has demanded that articles are
removed from the internet. Monckton is the man who wrote to Senators
Rockefeller and Snowe, claiming that their letter to ExxonMobil
offends the corporation's "right of free speech".

   After Martin Durkin's film was broadcast, one of the scientists it
featured, Professor Carl Wunsch, complained that his views on climate
change had been misrepresented. He says he has received a legal letter
from Durkin's production company, Wag TV, threatening to sue him for
defamation unless he agrees to make a public statement that he was
neither misrepresented nor misled.

   Would it be terribly impolite to suggest that when such people
complain of censorship, a certain amount of projection is taking
place?

   --------

   Monbiot.com
HIV Positive - 10 Apr 2007 17:55 GMT
>http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/041007P.shtml

>    Global warming scientists are under intense pressure to water down
>findings, and are then accused of silencing their critics.

It doesn't really matter: Global Dimming is far more worrying. :)
Signature

URL: http://hiv.positive.googlepages.com/
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rocketscience - 10 Apr 2007 22:18 GMT
> In any form...same sh.t stinks whether it's Bush and climate changed
> caused by humans (and greedy low life bastards like Bush/Cheney) or an
[quoted text clipped - 152 lines]
>
>     Monbiot.com

http://www.hiv-aids-factorfraud.com/

http://aidsmyth.addr.com/enteraidsmyth.htm

We are a global-reach voluntary group. Our goal is ensuring the
interests of AIDS-diagnosed people are no longer secondary to the
interests of drug suppliers, service providers and the AIDS research
industry.

Did You Know that many experts now contend AIDS is not a fatal,
incurable condition caused by HIV?

We bring you the voices of alternative scientists and reforming
campaigners worldwide.  We are independent of vested pharmaceutical
and medical interests -offering readers and forum members, global news
and leading edge views on diagnosis and treatment.

Most of the information you receive is commercially driven and based
on misleading assumptions or unfounded estimates and predictions. The
symptoms associated with AIDS are treatable using non-toxic, immune
enhancing therapies that have restored health and have enabled those
truly at risk to remain well.

rocketscience
GMCarter - 11 Apr 2007 12:08 GMT
snip
>We are a global-reach voluntary group. Our goal is ensuring the
>interests of AIDS-diagnosed people are
...forced to die an early death believing a whole load of hogswallop.
JOHN - 10 Apr 2007 23:53 GMT
> In any form...same sh.t stinks whether it's Bush and climate changed
> caused by humans (and greedy low life bastards like Bush/Cheney) or an
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> George M. Carter

Your whole life revolves around HIV and AIDS, both full of numerous lies

what does that say about you?

Watch The Secret and give us a break
GMCarter - 11 Apr 2007 12:10 GMT
>> In any form...same sh.t stinks whether it's Bush and climate changed
>> caused by humans (and greedy low life bastards like Bush/Cheney) or an
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>
>what does that say about you?

It says I want my friends and loved ones to stay alive and well. That
I'm tired of watching most of my friends die.

It says I've WATCHED many people survive and do well, some for
decades. MOST of those wind up taking ARV....and most do fairly well
although it can often be a struggle.

>Watch The Secret and give us a break

Why? The Secret is like Denialism. A load of fantasy.

I am a little tired of seeing HIV+ people buy your brand of lies and
wind up dying of AIDS.

        George M. Carter
HIV Positive - 11 Apr 2007 14:00 GMT
>>Your whole life revolves around HIV and AIDS, both full of numerous lies
>>
>>what does that say about you?

>It says I want my friends and loved ones to stay alive and well. That
>I'm tired of watching most of my friends die.
>
>It says I've WATCHED many people survive and do well, some for
>decades. MOST of those wind up taking ARV....and most do fairly well
>although it can often be a struggle.

So you're saying that most of your friends have been diagnosed HIV+,
taken ARVs and then died.  Do you not seeing a pattern here?

Perhaps you need to widen your circle of friends a bit.

>I am a little tired of seeing HIV+ people buy your brand of lies and
>wind up dying of AIDS.

Is there a large number of HIV+ people who don't believe
HIV=AIDS=Death?  I thought only a tiny number of us didn't follow that
theory.  Virtually the whole medical establishment seems to be geared
to pushing that hypothesis.  None of the doctors I've seen, or
literature I've read at the clinic, suggest anything else.

And in my experience once people have been diagnosed HIV+ they are
very eager to follow the HIV=AIDS=Death drug path.
Signature

URL: http://hiv.positive.googlepages.com/
Moible: +447939991519

GMCarter - 11 Apr 2007 17:27 GMT
>>>Your whole life revolves around HIV and AIDS, both full of numerous lies
>>>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
>So you're saying that most of your friends have been diagnosed HIV+,
>taken ARVs and then died.  Do you not seeing a pattern here?

No, I am not saying that. Most of my friends died in the 80s before
even AZT was available. A number of others died in the early 90s when
combinations like AZT/3TC were having a minimal impact.

Yes, some of my friends have died since HAART has been available. But
a number of my friends who were VERY close to death are still here.
And they attribute that to starting ARV therapy. And many to also
using interventions like a potent multi and other CAM therapies.

>Perhaps you need to widen your circle of friends a bit.

Perhaps you shouldn't be quite such an a.shole!

>>I am a little tired of seeing HIV+ people buy your brand of lies and
>>wind up dying of AIDS.
>
>Is there a large number of HIV+ people who don't believe
>HIV=AIDS=Death?  

Is there a large number of people who believe the earth is flat?

There are a lot of people living with HIV who realize that we all die.
This is just rhetorical blathering.

>I thought only a tiny number of us didn't follow that
>theory.  Virtually the whole medical establishment seems to be geared
>to pushing that hypothesis.  None of the doctors I've seen, or
>literature I've read at the clinic, suggest anything else.

You will most probably discover that HIV leading to less than 100 T
cells leads to potentially fatal illness.

>And in my experience once people have been diagnosed HIV+ they are
>very eager to follow the HIV=AIDS=Death drug path.

What is your experience? And why should we believe you since you
remain anonymous?

        George M. Carter
HIV Positive - 11 Apr 2007 18:28 GMT
>>>>Your whole life revolves around HIV and AIDS, both full of numerous lies
>>>>
>>>>what does that say about you?

>>>It says I want my friends and loved ones to stay alive and well. That
>>>I'm tired of watching most of my friends die.
>>>
>>>It says I've WATCHED many people survive and do well, some for
>>>decades. MOST of those wind up taking ARV....and most do fairly well
>>>although it can often be a struggle.

>>So you're saying that most of your friends have been diagnosed HIV+,
>>taken ARVs and then died.  Do you not seeing a pattern here?

>No, I am not saying that. Most of my friends died in the 80s before
>even AZT was available. A number of others died in the early 90s when
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>And they attribute that to starting ARV therapy. And many to also
>using interventions like a potent multi and other CAM therapies.

Things are all getting a big vague now.  "Some...many...most."

Do you seek out only friends who have been diagnosed HIV+?

>>Perhaps you need to widen your circle of friends a bit.

>Perhaps you shouldn't be quite such an a.shole!

Oh come on.  You do seem to surround yourself with one type of person.

>>>I am a little tired of seeing HIV+ people buy your brand of lies and
>>>wind up dying of AIDS.

>>Is there a large number of HIV+ people who don't believe
>>HIV=AIDS=Death?  

>Is there a large number of people who believe the earth is flat?
>
>There are a lot of people living with HIV who realize that we all die.
>This is just rhetorical blathering.

I don't think that's got anything to do with HIV or AIDS.

You seem be getting upset that someone disagrees with your
HIV=AIDS=Death theory.  I was just suggesting that most people agree
with you, so I can't really understand what you're getting all worked
up about.

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a liar or telling lies.  Be
happy: you have a lot of rich and powerful organisations on your side.
Your government believes you, drug companies believe you, doctors
believe you.  And your friends believe you.

>>I thought only a tiny number of us didn't follow that
>>theory.  Virtually the whole medical establishment seems to be geared
>>to pushing that hypothesis.  None of the doctors I've seen, or
>>literature I've read at the clinic, suggest anything else.

>You will most probably discover that HIV leading to less than 100 T
>cells leads to potentially fatal illness.

You seem a bit obsessed with my mortality.  I'm not surprised your
friends are dropping like flies with you whispering "you're going to
die" in their ears.

I am fine.  I am healthy.

If you were in the UK I'd pop round for coffee just to prove it.  I
think you'd be surprised how well I'm doing.  I would come to the US
if it wasn't so far away and you didn't have that AIDS thing over
there.  We have different HIV and AIDS here in the UK. :)

>>And in my experience once people have been diagnosed HIV+ they are
>>very eager to follow the HIV=AIDS=Death drug path.

>What is your experience? And why should we believe you since you
>remain anonymous?

I've never met anyone in real life who has even considered that the
HIV=AIDS=Death theory might not be correct.  Everyone I've met are
quite happy to drug themselves up to the eyeballs without even
questioning it.

People are free to contact me and get to know me better if they wish.
I publish a valid email address and telephone number.
Signature

URL: http://hiv.positive.googlepages.com/
Moible: +447939991519

GMCarter - 11 Apr 2007 22:41 GMT
snip

>Things are all getting a big vague now.  "Some...many...most."

I haven't kept count.

>Do you seek out only friends who have been diagnosed HIV+?

When I make friends with people, their HIV status is irrelevant.

>>>Perhaps you need to widen your circle of friends a bit.
>
>>Perhaps you shouldn't be quite such an a.shole!
>
>Oh come on.  You do seem to surround yourself with one type of person.

No. That's just another one of your disingenuous and ignorant
projections.

snip
>You seem be getting upset that someone disagrees with your
>HIV=AIDS=Death theory.  I was just suggesting that most people agree
>with you, so I can't really understand what you're getting all worked
>up about.

Because your beliefs kill people. It is upsetting to me. Perhaps you
like to be blase about it. It wouldn't be so bad if idiots like Thabo
Mbeki didn't buy the bullshit too and kill a lot of his own people as
a result.

>Not everyone who disagrees with you is a liar or telling lies.  Be
>happy: you have a lot of rich and powerful organisations on your side.

That's another reason. This denialist bullshit deflects from
addressign the GENUINE problems. Like price gouging by pharma. Like
Bush's deceit, lies and murder.

snip
>>You will most probably discover that HIV leading to less than 100 T
>>cells leads to potentially fatal illness.
>
>You seem a bit obsessed with my mortality.  I'm not surprised your
>friends are dropping like flies with you whispering "you're going to
>die" in their ears.

I don't whisper that in anyone's ear. Again--more despicable rhetoric
that sounds like Karl Rove.

>I am fine.  I am healthy.

And my prediction is that unless you seek treatment (are you taking
any at all?), you will probably be very sick if not dead within 1-2
years.

>If you were in the UK I'd pop round for coffee just to prove it.  I
>think you'd be surprised how well I'm doing.  I would come to the US
>if it wasn't so far away and you didn't have that AIDS thing over
>there.  We have different HIV and AIDS here in the UK. :)

You know, others said the same thing til they got their first bout of
PCP or cryptococcal meningitis.

        George M. Carter
HIV Positive - 12 Apr 2007 00:51 GMT
>>Do you seek out only friends who have been diagnosed HIV+?

>When I make friends with people, their HIV status is irrelevant.

You seem to have a lot of friends who have been diagnosed HIV+.
Perhaps there's something in the water.

>>Oh come on.  You do seem to surround yourself with one type of person.

>No. That's just another one of your disingenuous and ignorant
>projections.

Well, you did say you were tired of watching most of your friends die.
Perhaps subconsciously you seek to befriend people who are dying.

>>You seem be getting upset that someone disagrees with your
>>HIV=AIDS=Death theory.  I was just suggesting that most people agree
>>with you, so I can't really understand what you're getting all worked
>>up about.

>Because your beliefs kill people. It is upsetting to me. Perhaps you
>like to be blase about it. It wouldn't be so bad if idiots like Thabo
>Mbeki didn't buy the bullshit too and kill a lot of his own people as
>a result.

I feel upset when I read about Mothers who have been diagnosed HIV+
being forced to give their new born HIV- babies AZT.

>>Not everyone who disagrees with you is a liar or telling lies.  Be
>>happy: you have a lot of rich and powerful organisations on your side.

>That's another reason. This denialist bullshit deflects from
>addressign the GENUINE problems. Like price gouging by pharma. Like
>Bush's deceit, lies and murder.

Millions of people being poisoned in the name of profit is a genuine
problem.

>>You seem a bit obsessed with my mortality.  I'm not surprised your
>>friends are dropping like flies with you whispering "you're going to
>>die" in their ears.

>I don't whisper that in anyone's ear. Again--more despicable rhetoric
>that sounds like Karl Rove.

You keep telling ME I'm going to die.

>>I am fine.  I am healthy.

>And my prediction is that unless you seek treatment (are you taking
>any at all?), you will probably be very sick if not dead within 1-2
>years.

Ah, there you go with the death stuff again.

>>If you were in the UK I'd pop round for coffee just to prove it.  I
>>think you'd be surprised how well I'm doing.  I would come to the US
>>if it wasn't so far away and you didn't have that AIDS thing over
>>there.  We have different HIV and AIDS here in the UK. :)

>You know, others said the same thing til they got their first bout of
>PCP or cryptococcal meningitis.

You're full of kind thoughts.
Signature

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Moible: +447939991519

GMCarter - 12 Apr 2007 01:35 GMT
>>>Do you seek out only friends who have been diagnosed HIV+?
>
>>When I make friends with people, their HIV status is irrelevant.
>
>You seem to have a lot of friends who have been diagnosed HIV+.

I'm gay. I live in NYC. I joined ACT UP in 1989. I did performance art
in the 80s. I think that brings me into contact with a lot of at risk
people.

>Perhaps there's something in the water.

NYC water is some of the best in the US. Or there'd be closer to 7
million people living with AIDS here.

>>>Oh come on.  You do seem to surround yourself with one type of person.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>Well, you did say you were tired of watching most of your friends die.
>Perhaps subconsciously you seek to befriend people who are dying.

We are all dying. And nope, I'd rather be with friends in this life a
bit longer.

Watching people die is extraordinarily painful. I imagine you have had
friends and loved ones die as well.

>>>You seem be getting upset that someone disagrees with your
>>>HIV=AIDS=Death theory.  I was just suggesting that most people agree
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>I feel upset when I read about Mothers who have been diagnosed HIV+
>being forced to give their new born HIV- babies AZT.

I become more upset that so many  mothers don't have access to clean
water and food.

>>>Not everyone who disagrees with you is a liar or telling lies.  Be
>>>happy: you have a lot of rich and powerful organisations on your side.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>Millions of people being poisoned in the name of profit is a genuine
>problem.

Millions of people denied treatment because of profit is a genuine
problem.

>>>You seem a bit obsessed with my mortality.  I'm not surprised your
>>>friends are dropping like flies with you whispering "you're going to
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
>You keep telling ME I'm going to die.

LOL...you are. So am I. Unfortunately,if you are really HIV+ with a
low CD4 count, chances are you will die relatively soon.

I could die tonight but the chances are somewhat less.

>>>I am fine.  I am healthy.
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Ah, there you go with the death stuff again.

Yep.

>>>If you were in the UK I'd pop round for coffee just to prove it.  I
>>>think you'd be surprised how well I'm doing.  I would come to the US
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
>You're full of kind thoughts.

Just a dose of reality--I hope you will wise up and avoid these
outcomes.

Your choice.

        George M. Carter
Death - 12 Apr 2007 04:47 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

> I'm gay. I live in NYC. I joined ACT UP in 1989. I did performance art...

for the pharma companies. you still dance to their tunes
like a good puppet.

You forgot to tell him how act-up booted your a.s out
because of your pharma ties.
GMCarter - 12 Apr 2007 11:30 GMT
>"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
>> I'm gay. I live in NYC. I joined ACT UP in 1989. I did performance art...
>
>for the pharma companies. you still dance to their tunes
>like a good puppet.

Quite to the contrary! LOL....your still dancing to your own vitus of
hate....look what happened to Imus.

>You forgot to tell him how act-up booted your a.s out
>because of your pharma ties.

So now you  just make up lies, eh? I am still a member of ACT UP.

I have no pharma ties.

You are an anonymous coward, stuck in his miserable life of hate.

Best of luck, dear.

        George M. Carter
Death - 12 Apr 2007 16:55 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

> So now you  just make up lies, eh? I am still a member of ACT UP.

Yes, the splintered branch that left act-up over pharma ties.
Denialism, lol, a wanna-be master of half-truths.
monty1945@lycos.com - 12 Apr 2007 23:22 GMT
"...average survival following starting "highly toxic" ART is now 35
years
(as compared to survival of less than 2 years without ART)..."

Talk about "denialism" - this is a blatant denial of reality I've
heard in a very long time.  Where in the world is the evidence for
this?  And by the way, I'm willing to be "infected" (with "HIV" and
nothing else) if you agree to my terms.  Since I am to live less than
2 years, according to you, if I live at least 4 years, you pay me
three times the suggested retail price of the "HIV" drugs for the rest
of my life (I will never take any of these drugs, nor do I take
antibiotics or any other "medicine" - haven't for several years now,
aside from 3 or 4 aspirin).  You get $50,000 if I live 4 years or
less, AND you can use this as an example of what happens to poor,
deluded "denialists."

I am waiting...
monty1945@lycos.com - 12 Apr 2007 23:35 GMT
Just out of curiousity, have you taken a look at actual causes of
death of those said to be "HIV infected?"  Are you suggesting that all
those destroyed livers were destroyed by "HIV?"  If so, this is a new
claim, and I'd like to see what evidence you are basing this claim
upon.  However, as an "HIV/AIDS" apologist, a coherent, scientifically-
sound explanation is the last thing I would expect you to respond
with.
DavidT - 16 Apr 2007 18:53 GMT
On 12 Apr, 23:35, monty1...@lycos.com wrote:
> Just out of curiousity, have you taken a look at actual causes of
> death of those said to be "HIV infected?"  Are you suggesting that all
> those destroyed livers were destroyed by "HIV?"  If so, this is a new
> claim, and I'd like to see what evidence you are basing this claim
> upon.  

Evidence, coming up....... (not that the liver deaths are due to HIV
exactly, but that they are due to hepatitis coinfection, primarily,
and evidence that patients do not all die from liver failure anyway,
which is a denialist myth)

Remember, liver related deaths have only risen as a PROPORTION of
total AIDS deaths because treatment with HAART has dramatically cut
AIDS mortality overall.

According to this study, only 14.5% of deaths are liver related (and
you will find only 2.7% of liver deaths are directly attributable to
HAART if you actually read the study, which I doubt you will bother to
do as I doubt you wish your prejudices to be challenged)

Again, slower this time... two  point  seven  percent  of  liver
deaths. Thats 0.4% of the total deaths.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=Abstra
ctPlus&list_uids=16908797&query_hl=3&itool=pubmed_docsum

rocketscience - 17 Apr 2007 13:25 GMT
> On 12 Apr, 23:35, monty1...@lycos.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&...

You lie like a rug.

How long have you been a shill for the drug industry, peddling your
death pills to the unsuspecting?

Entire web sites devoted to HAART liver toxicity with links to
articles:

http://www.hivandhepatitis.com/hiv_and_aids/hepatotoxicity/hepatotoxicity.html

http://www.hcvadvocate.org/hcsp/articles/Haart_2006.html

http://jac.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/50/5/763

http://aras.ab.ca/haart-liver.html

rocketscience
GMCarter - 17 Apr 2007 13:32 GMT
snip
>You lie like a rug.
>
>How long have you been a shill for the drug industry, peddling your
>death pills to the unsuspecting?

LOL...speak for yourself, Frodlet. YOU'RE the one working for PHARMA
to play Rovie SwiftBoat slut!

Now go on--start vomiting the vitriol all over.
DavidT - 17 Apr 2007 14:35 GMT
> > On 12 Apr, 23:35, monty1...@lycos.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 30 lines]
> Entire web sites devoted to HAART liver toxicity with links to
> articles:

Did you even bother to read the article I cited?

Yes, there are web links to liver toxicity articles. Lets see what
they say shall we.....?

> http://www.hivandhepatitis.com/hiv_and_aids/hepatotoxicity/hepatotoxi...
This one I canot access, but from the title I would predict this
implicates viral hepatitis coinfection as a major factor.

> http://www.hcvadvocate.org/hcsp/articles/Haart_2006.html
This one states: "In patients with HIV, the term "hepatotoxicity" may
be misleading because some of these elevated liver tests may not be
directly caused by the medication in question. Instead, acute viral
hepatitis, reactivation of chronic hepatitis B or C, and alcohol
ingestion may all play a role in such events. Of note, patients often
take alternative and complementary medicines in association with HAART
and several of these have been associated with clear-cut drug induced
liver disease.2 In addition, an elevation of transaminases is a
sensitive signal for liver injury; however it may not be specific or
even clinically relevant, as most instances of 'transaminitis' improve
despite drug continuation.3 Most often (70-85%), these enzyme
elevations are not accompanied by symptoms."

> http://jac.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/50/5/763
This article starts by saying: "The life expectancy of HIV-positive
subjects has dramatically improved with the use of triple drug
combinations."
It then goes on to describe a single AIDS case. The patient developed
PCP, and had markedly deranged liver function, This settled, then the
patient was put on HAART of which efavirenz was a component. The
patient's liver function deteriorated again, and she died.
The authors conclude efavirenz was to blame.

They report this case precisely BECAUSE of its rarity value.
According to your ilk, thousands of patients have this happen to them
all the time - so why on earth do you think that a prestigious science
journal would want to publish a single case report?
The authors state there are no previously recorded cases of efavirenz-
induced liver failure, that is why;- This case is the first.
They also say: "severe hepatitis remains very uncommon in patients
receiving any HAART regimen."

> http://aras.ab.ca/haart-liver.html
I cannot access this publication either, but judging by your citation
expertise so far, I suspect it will agree with me also.

In conclusion, not only have you failed to comprehend anything I have
explained to you regarding the cause and frequency of liver toxicity
in HIV patients, you have cited articles that actually support my
claims. You however are probably too stupid to appreciate this fact,
as I see you have a significant comprehension difficulty.
Death - 18 Apr 2007 17:01 GMT
"DavidT" <david199@volcanomail.com> wrote in message

> > http://aras.ab.ca/haart-liver.html
> I cannot access this publication either, but judging by your citation
> expertise so far, I suspect it will agree with me also.

Here ya go, in toto:

Alberta Reappraising AIDS Society

David Crowe, President
Phone: +1-403-289-6609
Fax: +1-403-289-6658
Email: David.Crowe@aras.ab.ca

Katherine Newell, Treasurer Box 61037, Kensington Postal Outlet
Calgary, Alberta T2N 4S6
Canada Office
Phone: +1-403-220-0129
Email: aras@aras.ab.ca
Web: www.aras.ab.ca
Rethinkers Quotes AZT HAART HIV Tests Transmission Library

Liver Damage
HAART therapy can cause serious or even fatal liver damage.

"From January 2003 to June 2006, eight consecutive HIV-infected patients (seven Caucasian and
one African) were referred for cryptogenic [unknown cause] liver disease.During the same
period, 178 HIV-infected patients were admitted to the same unit for the treatment or the
evaluation of chronic liver disease and 97 underwent liver biopsy.With the exception of HIV
infection and the associated liver disease, none of these patients had significant
co-morbidity, especially considering cardiac or renal pathology. They did not take any other
hepatotoxic medication apart from antiretroviral drugs.No patients had had opportunistic
infection.A clear nodular architecture was seen in seven patients, whereas in the last one, NRH
[nodular regenerative hyperplasia of the liver] was suspected on the presence of sinusoidal
dilatation in a clinical context of portal hypertension.To date, all patients are alive, and
three are waiting for liver transplantation."
Mallet V et al. Nodular regenerative hyperplasia is a new cause of chronic liver disease in
HIV-infected patients. AIDS. 2007 Jan 11;21(2):187-92.
"We here report a 52-year-old white male (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention stage C3)
with a 20-year history of multidrug-resistant HIV. In February 2005 he was started on an
antiretroviral regimen with TPV and RTV (500/200 mg twice daily), continuing the existing
regimen of zidovudine/lamivudine (300/150 mg twice daily) and T-20 (90 mg twice daily), which
was started 12 months before without hepatic disorders.Two weeks after the initiation of the
TPV containing regimen, the patient developed elevated liver enzymes.HBV DNA viral load was low
with 20 000 copies/ml, autoimmune markers for hepatitis and cirrhosis were negative, excessive
alcohol consumption was denied. Percutaneous liver biopsy showed a mild, non-active hepatitis
with moderate lymphocyte infiltration in the portal areas and no intrahepatic steatosis.
Following the patient's wish to interrupt the T-20 [enfuvirtide, a fusion inhibitor] treatment
because of severe local skin reactions, and under the assumption of a hepatotoxic effect of the
antiretroviral regimen T-20 was discontinued for 6 weeks. Shortly after, liver function
improved with a 50% decrease in LFT values. Due to a weight loss of 10 kg and an elevation of
the viral load treatment with T-20 was recommenced and 2 weeks later after an increase of the
G-GT TPV/RTV was discontinued. The liver function tests returned to normal within 4 weeks."
Julg B, Bogner J, Goebel F. Severe hepatotoxicity associated with the combination of
enfuvirtide and tipranavir/ritonavir: case report. AIDS. 2006 Jul 13;20(11):1563.
"Aptivus [tipranavir] co-administered with 200 mg Ritonavir has been associated with reports of
clinical hepatitis and hepatic decompensation including some fatalities"
Aptivus (tipranavir) prescribing information. Boehringer Ingelheim. 2006 Jun 27.
"Considering the 86 patients in the follow-up study, 17 were found to be HBV-DNA positive, 13
on admission and four in the subsequent observation.28 (32.5%) experienced a hepatic flare [at
least a tripling of the liver enzyme serum alanine aminotrasferase between two consecutive
measurements].Of the 13 patients who were HBV-DNA positive on admission, two did not receive
HAART; one of these two experienced a hepatic flare after a 12-month observation. The other 11
patients were treated with HAART containing lamivudine and were HBV-DNA negative at the
subsequent check points. Of these 11, four became HBV-DNA positive under lamivudine treatment
and experienced a hepatic flare; two of these four also experienced a hepatic flare after the
discontinuation of the drug. Another two of these 11 patients (Fig. 1f, g) became HBV-DNA
positive and experienced a hepatic flare, respectively, 4 and 8 months after lamivudine was
discontinued because of lack of efficacy of the HAART regimen. The remaining five patients of
the 11 treated remained HBV-DNA negative under HAART containing lamivudine and did not
experience a hepatic flare.[in summary] in approximately half of the lamivudine treated
patients occult HBV replication became detectable again after 12-40 months of lamivudine
treatment, always associated with a hepatic flare."
Filippini P et al. Impact of occult hepatitis B virus infection in HIV patients naive for
antiretroviral therapy. AIDS. 2006 Jun 12;20(9):1253-1260.
"Patients with steatosis [fat deposits in the liver] grade 2/3 [severe] were more likely to be
receiving antiretroviral therapy than were patients with grade 1 [mild] steatosis (84% versus
77%) and patients without steatosis (69%). NRTI-based [nucleoside reverse-transcriptase
inhibitors such as AZT] treatment was more frequent among patients with steatosis grade 2/3
than among patients with grade 1 or grade 0 steatosis (82%, 75% and 68%,
respectively).Lipodystrophy [fat redistribution, also associated with long-term antiretroviral
drug use] was present in 15.7% overall, i.e., 21% in patients with grade 2/3 steatosis, 15% in
patients with grade 1 steatosis, and 11% in patients with no steatosis."
Bani-Sadr F et al. Hepatic steatosis in HIV-HCV coinfected patients: analysis of risk factors.
AIDS. 2006 Feb 28;20(4):525-531.
"Hepatocellular carcinoma (HCC) is an increasing cause of mortality in HIV-seropositive
individuals.All HIV-infected subjects with a diagnosis of HCC included in three cancer registry
databases were enrolled in the study [using HCC cases from Brescia, North Italy in 1995-1998 as
controls].41 HIV-infected subjects with HCC were identified.31 patients (77%) were on highly
active antiretroviral therapy."
Puoti M et al. Hepatocellular carcinoma in HIV-infected patients: epidemiological features,
clinical presentation and outcome. AIDS. 2004 Nov 19;18(17):2285-2293.
"We report the first observation of acute hepatic cytolysis associated with atazanavir [a new
azapeptide protease inhibitor].transaminase activity gradually increased after the introduction
of atazanavir, with a marked increase between weeks 8 and 30 (up to 10 times the normal value).
At admission, physical examination showed afebrile subclinical jaundice. The abdominal
examination was strictly normal (no hepatomegaly). No signs of chronic liver disease or liver
failure were found. Laboratory tests revealed major cytolysis [breakdown of cells in the
liver]"
Eholié SP et al. Acute hepatic cytolysis in an HIV-infected patient taking atazanavir. AIDS.
2004 Jul 23;18(11):1610-11.
"Abnormalities in hepatic function have become one of the most common complications occurring
among human immunodeficiency virus (HIV)-infected individuals receiving highly active
antiretroviral therapy (HAART), and liver disease has become an increasingly important cause of
morbidity and mortality in HIV-infected patients. We present a case of a patient with HIV
infection and hepatotoxicity that exemplifies the complications currently observed during the
treatment of such patients.Although coinfection with HCV and HIV has become a common clinical
problem, optimal treatment of such patients remains to be defined and must be individualized to
maximize benefit and tolerance."
Kottilil S, Polis MA, Kovacs JA. HIV Infection, hepatitis C infection, and HAART: hard clinical
choices. JAMA. 2004 Jul 14;292(2):243-50.
"The most common laboratory abnormalities [found with Kaletra, a combination of the protease
inhibitors Lopinavir and Ritonavir] are increases in some tests of liver function."
Kaletra (lopinavir/ritonavir). The Center for AIDS. 2004 Apr.
"when mortality [in British hemophiliacs] from other [non-HIV] causes was examined separately,
a substantial increase over time remained, with the value during 1991-1996 almost double that
for 1985-1990 and no appreciable decline in 1997-1999. The increase was entirely caused by an
increase in liver disease, which during 1997-1999 was the certified cause of death for over 25%
of deaths in HIV-infected individuals.For deaths that were classified neither as HIV related
nor from liver disease, mortality remained virtually constant during 1985-1999, albeit at a
higher level than that of HIV-uninfected individuals. It seems likely that at least some of
these deaths were attributable to HIV, although there was no indication that the individuals
concerned had developed an AIDS-defining condition. HAART has been associated with several
categories of major toxic effects, but there was no evidence of any deaths occurring as a
result of HAART in this population. [but what other explanation is there?]"
Darby SC et al. The impact of HIV on mortality rates in the complete UK haemophilia population.
AIDS. 2004 Feb 20;18(3):525-33.
"Women with CD4+ counts >250 cells/mm3, including pregnant women receiving chronic treatment
for HIV infection, are at considerably higher risk (12 fold) of hepatotoxicity [liver damage].
Some of these events have been fatal.The greatest risk of severe and potentially fatal hepatic
events (often associated with rash) occurs in the first 6 weeks of VIRAMUNE [nevirapine]
treatment. However, the risk continues after this time and patients should be monitored closely
for the first 18 weeks of treatment with VIRAMUNE.In some cases hepatic injury progresses
despite discontinuation of treatment. [Boehringer Ingelheim is the manufacturer of Nevirapine]"
Shepard KV. Re: Clarification of risk factors for severe, life-threatening and fatal
hepatotoxicity with VIRAMUNE (nevirapine). Boehringer Ingelheim. 2004 Feb.
"30 non-HIV-infected individuals developed hepatotoxicity [liver toxicity] after 8 to 35 days
of single-agent nevirapine (8 people) or a nevirapine-containing PEP regimen (22). Findings
included ECOG grade 3 [confined to bed at least half the day] or 4 [completely disabled]
hepatotoxicity (n = 14), fevers (n = 11), skin rashes (n = 8), eosinophilia (n = 6), and
fulminant hepatic necrosis requiring an orthotopic liver transplant (n = 1). Rates of severe
hepatotoxicity (grade 3 or 4) in non-HIV-infected individuals ranged from 10% (4/41) to 62%
(5/8). Liver biopsy material from 2 individuals was consistent with a hypersensitivity
syndrome."
Patel SM et al. Serious Adverse Cutaneous and Hepatic Toxicities Associated With Nevirapine Use
by Non-HIV-Infected Individuals. J Acquir Immune Defic Syndr. 2004 Feb 1;35(2):120-125.
"In multivariate analysis [of 692 Thai HIV patients], predictors of severe hepatotoxicity
[liver toxicity] were HBV [Hepatitis B virus] or HCV [Hepatitis C virus] coinfection, and
NNRTI[Non-Nucleoside Reverse Transcriptase Inhibitor]-containing therapy. Incidence of severe
hepatotoxicity was particularly high among patients receiving nevirapine and
nevirapine/efavirenz"
Law WP et al. Risk of severe hepatotoxicity associated with antiretroviral therapy in the
HIV-NAT Cohort, Thailand, 1996-2001. AIDS. 2003 Oct 17;17(15):2191-9.
"306 patients started a nevirapine-containing regimen, of whom 8 developed an acute hepatitis
(2.6%) in a median of 24 days. Transaminases peaked at 28 days. Injury pattern was in general
mixed-hepatocellular. Withdrawal of the antiretroviral agent led to rapid restoration of
transaminase levels and resolution of clinical symptoms."
De Maat MM et al. Case series of acute hepatitis in a non-selected group of HIV-infected
patients on nevirapine-containing antiretroviral treatment. AIDS. 2003 Oct 17;17(15):2209-14.
"In 655 individuals receiving HIV postexposure prophylaxis (PEP), drug-induced aminotransferase
alterations were frequent and severe in the nevirapine-including regimen, rare and
mild-to-moderate in other combinations, and always reversible. Grade 3-4 incidence in protease
inhibitor or nevirapine PEP was 0.5 and 25.0 per 100 person-months, respectively. Apart from
nevirapine, continuing PEP appears to be safe [but without long-term follow-up this claim is a
bit shaky] even in the case of aminotransferase alterations. The usefulness of routine
monitoring of liver function during PEP could be re-considered."
Puro V et al. Drug-induced aminotransferase alterations during antiretroviral HIV pos-exposure
prophylaxis. AIDS. 2003 Sep 5;17(13):1988-90.
"Nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NRTIs) induce mitochondrial toxic effects
resulting in multiple organ disorders. Liver involvement has been associated mainly with severe
lactic acidosis and massive steatosis [fatty degeneration].13 patients with HIV infection
treated with NRTI-based regimens had low-grade abnormal liver test results associated with
digestive and nonspecific general symptoms. Histologic examination of liver samples showed
diffuse steatosis in only 6 cases and mild steatosis in the remaining cases.In all cases,
ultrastructural study disclosed mitochondrial abnormalities. Our work demonstrates that
NRTI-induced toxic effects in the liver may occur as indolent [without symptoms] nonspecific
disease [but probably not forever, as the side effects worsen]"
Van Huyen JP et al. Toxic effects of nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors on the liver.
Value of electron microscopy analysis for the diagnosis of mitochondrial cytopathy. Am J Clin
Pathol. 2003 Apr;119(4):546-55.
"755 HIV-seropositive patients consecutively prescribed new [i.e. changed, not necessarily the
first] ART [anti-retroviral therapy] were selected.26 cases of SH [severe hepatotoxicity] were
observed with an incidence of 4.2% person-years. Liver failure (LF) was rarely seen (1.1 per
100 person-years).Death occurred during follow-up in 7 of 26 (27%) patients, all of whom showed
LF and baseline CD4 count less than 200 cells/mm. Relapse of SH was observed after ART was
recommenced in 7 of 17 (41%) patients. [Note that Severe Hepatotoxicity was also somewhat
associated with IV drug abuse and alcohol abuse, which may have been contributing factors]"
Puoti M et al. Severe hepatotoxicity during combination antiretroviral treatment: incidence,
liver histology, and outcome. J Acquir Immune Defic Syndr. 2003 Mar 1;32(3):259-67.
"the liver-related mortality rate was.twice as high after 1996, when highly active
antiretroviral therapy (HAART) was introduced."
Thio CL et al. HIV-1, hepatitis B virus, and risk of liver-related mortality in the Multicenter
Cohort Study (MACS). Lancet. 2002 Dec 14;360:1921-6.
"In this investigation, 492 patients.prescribed antiretroviral drugs between April 1989 and
September 2000 were included.The median duration of follow-up of the cohort was 1,392 days. HCV
[Hepatitis C] infection was present in 323 (68%). Mortality attributable to AIDS decreased from
4.5 to 1.8 per 100 persons per year. Mortality due to liver failure increased from 0.3 to 0.5
per 100 persons per year. The survival of patients with and without HCV infection was similar.
Although liver failure is an increasing cause of death among HIV-infected patients receiving
HAART, HCV infection has still no impact on the survival of HIV-infected patients."
Macias J et al. Mortality due to Liver Failure and Impact on Survival of Hepatitis Virus
Infections in HIV-Infected Patients Receiving Potent Antiretroviral Therapy. Eur J Clin
Microbiol Infect Dis. 2002 Nov;21(11):775-81.
"Liver fat content was significantly higher in the HAART+LD+ group than the HIV-.group
[obviously not taking HAART].The severity of the insulin resistance syndrome in patients with
HAART-associated lipodystrophy [abnormal fat distribution] is related to the extent of fat
accumulation in the liver"
Sutinen J et al. Increased fat accumulation in the liver in HIV-infected patients with
antiretroviral therapy-associated lipodystrophy. AIDS. 2002 Nov 8;16(16):2183-93.
"We describe a patient in whom disseminated intravascular coagulation (DIC) developed within 6
days after starting abacavir for the treatment of HIV infection [resulting in kidney failure
and liver abnormalities]"
Dargere S et al. Disseminated intravascular coagulation as a manifestation of abacavir
hypersensitivity reaction. AIDS. 2002 Aug 16;16(12):1696-967.
"Whether by HAART, viral hepatitis, or alcohol, transaminitis (elevated ALT and AST [liver
enzyme levels]) is common among those with HIV infection... In unadjusted analyses, CD4 [immune
cell counts], VL [viral load], and AST were significant predictors of survival in both cohorts
(p<0.001). ALT was significant only in CHORUS [one cohort].Transaminitis is a major determinant
of survival and should be carefully considered in all phases of HIV therapy [note that the
cumulative length of treatment with antiretroviral drugs, which are known to be toxic to the
liver, was not considered]"
Justice AC et al. HIV survival: liver function tests independently predict survival. XIV
International AIDS Conference. 2002 Jul;MoOrB1058.
"The occurrence of a severe elevation of [the liver enzymes] transaminases was associated with
poorer survival, although HCV [Hepatitis C Virus] was not. If liver toxicity may be treatment
induced, plasma drug concentrations could guide dosage adjustments ofantiretroviral treatments
currently prescribed to optimize their use."
Rancinan C et al. Is hepatitis C virus co-infection associated with survival in HIV-infected
patients treated by combination antiretroviral therapy?. AIDS. 2002 Jul 5;16(10):1357-62.
"Of the 560 patients, 44 (7.9%) developed grade 4 LEEs [Liver Enzyme Elevation].9 cases were
excluded from the analysis [due to other explanations for their liver problems] leaving 35
cases.6 (17.1%) of 35 patients were symptomatic. The most frequently occurring symptoms were
jaundice, dark urine, clay-colored stools, malaise, nausea, vomiting, and right upper quadrant
discomfort.the risk factors significantly associated with grade 4 LEE.were higher baseline ALT
levels, chronic HBV [Hepatitis B] infection [which could be a surrogate for the user of
additional drugs] , chronic HCV [Hepatitis C] infection [also possibly a surrogate for the use
of other drugs], the use of first-line potent antiretroviral combination regimens in patients
without prior NRTI [Nucleoside Reverse Transcriptase Inhibitor] treatment, recent start of
nevirapine or ritonavir, and female sex. Furthermore, among patients chronically coinfected
with HBV, discontinuing the use of 3TC was associated with the development of grade 4 LEE.[but]
5 (14%) had recently discontinued the use of 3TC while a chronic HBV infection was present
[which could indicate that 3TC caused the liver problems, but that 3TC was stopped before the
LEE worsened to grade 4]"
Ferdinand WNM et al. Incidence of and Risk Factors for Severe Hepatotoxicity Associated with
Antiretroviral Combination Therapy. J Infect Dis. 2002 Jun 14;186:23-31.
"Current highly active antiretroviral therapy (HAART) is based on combination regimens with
substances from three different classes: nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NRTI),
non-nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NNRTI) and protease inhibitors
(PI).HAART-associated toxicity has evolved as the main reason to discontinue or modify
antiretroviral therapy. Hepatotoxicity [liver damage] appears to be of particular importance in
this context as it can occur with any antiretroviral regimen currently in use. Most remarkably,
longitudinal surveys have not only reported an increased incidence of hepatic injury in
HAART-treated patients but also identified life-threatening hepatotoxic events and end-stage
liver disease in patients on antiretroviral treatment. Since rational alternatives to HAART
[i.e. not taking HAART is not rational] are currently not available to control HIV infection,
understanding the pathophysiology as well as a profound knowledge of how to prevent and to
treat HAART-related liver damage will be a continuous challenge [and source of income] for the
present and future generations of hepatologists."
Spengler U et al. Antiretroviral drug toxicity -- a challenge for the hepatologist?. J Hepatol.
2002 Feb;36(2):283-94.
"In a case-control study, 70 patients taking nevirapine (200 mg twice a day) triple
combinations were chosen and classified into two groups, one including subjects who developed
any grade of hepatotoxicity [liver disease], and a control group including subjects without
transaminase elevations. The use of nucleoside analogs was comparable in both groups...The peak
in transaminase levels [surrogate marker for liver toxicity] among the 33 subjects of the first
group occurred at a median time of 6.1 months after beginning nevirapine-based therapy...our
preliminary findings support the theory that nevirapine-associated liver toxicity occurring
after several months on therapy is not part of a systemic hypersensitivity reaction, and seems
to be correlated with higher plasma drug concentrations involving a dose-dependent mechanism"
Gonzalez de Requena D et al. Liver toxicity caused by nevirapine. AIDS. 2002 Jan
25;16(2):290-1.
"A number of patients experienced grade 3-4 laboratory abnormalities in liver function tests,
cholesterol, and triglycerides while receiving this drug combination"
Mangum EM, Graham KK. Lopinavir-Ritonavir: a new protease inhibitor. Pharmacotherapy. 2001
Nov;21(11):1352-63.
"In conclusion, we believe that our patient developed liver failure and portal hypertension in
the absence of cirrhosis because of long-term nucleoside-analogue therapy without development
of symptomatic lactic acidaemia. Gliclazide and metformin are not related to hepatocellular
damage; however, tuberculostatic drugs used might have accelerated this process. This case
suggests that even mild hyperlactaemia, which occurs in 15-35% of nucleoside-analogue-treated
patients, can be associated with progressive liver damage"
Kronenberg A et al. Liver failure after long-term nucleoside analogue therapy. Lancet. 2001 Sep
1;358(9283):759-60.
"We describe four instances of reversible hepatocellular [liver] damage associated with the use
of nevirapine in patients with HIV infection...Evidence of malaise, skin rash, and icteric
hepatitis [jaundice] with pruritis [skin rash] occurred 4-6 weeks after the beginning of
nevirapine therapy...In all cases, liver test results declined to normal or near normal levels,
and pruritus disappeared 4-6 weeks after discontinuation of the medication. No patient was
rechallenged with the drug."
Bonacini et al. Jaundice and hepatocellular damage associated with Nevirapine therapy. Am J
Gastroenterol. 2001;96(5):1571-4.
"The cases of 2 patients with nevirapine-associated hepatotoxicity [liver damage].are reported
here. Both patients' conditions improved following withdrawal of nevirapine..Until a better
understanding of the clinical spectrum and pathophysiology of nevirapine-associated
hepatotoxicity is realized, treatment will remain largely empiric [translation: we are not too
sure what we are doing, but we never like to take a drug away from a patient]"
Bundow D et al. Optimal Treatment of Nevirapine-Associated Hepatotoxicity Remains Uncertain.
The AIDS Reader. 2001;11(11):577-80
www.medscape.com/SCP/TAR/2001/v11.n11/a1111.03.bund/a1111.03.bund-01.html.
"A comprehensive retrospective review of more than 10,000 adult AIDS patients participating in
21 different AIDS Clinical Trials Group (ACTG) studies [confirms]... that antiretroviral
therapy is associated with a high rate of severe hepatotoxicity [liver damage], regardless of
drug class or combination. Dr. Chung of Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston presented the
findings to the Digestive Disease Week annual meeting...The researchers evaluated data for AIDS
patients, enrolled in ACTG studies between 1991 and 2000. The subjects were taking a variety of
drug combinations including one or more nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NRTIs),
non-nucleoside reverse transcriptase inhibitors (NNRTIs) and protease inhibitors
(PIs)...Overall, 10% of patients developed grade 3 and 4 hepatotoxicity and 23% of them had to
discontinue therapy permanently. According to the data, 2.5% of all deaths in the study period
were liver related. NNRTI[non-nucleoside reverse-transcriptase inhibitors]-containing regimens,
especially those including nevirapine and efavirenz, were particularly hard on the liver, with
high rates of discontinuation."
High Rate of Severe Liver Toxicity Associated With Antiretroviral Therapy. Reuters Health. 2001
May 23.
"Acute hepatitis with lactic acidosis is a life-threatening but [sometimes] reversible toxic
effect on mitochondria of HIV-1 nucleoside-analogue treatment [later this letter notes that 80%
of patients with lactate greater than 10 mmol/L die]. We report fatal portal hypertension,
liver failure, and persistent mitochondrial dysfunction in a man aged 65 years with HIV-1
infection who had recovered from nucleoside-analogue-induced acute hepatitis and lactic
acidaemia more than 18 months previously. We believe that symptom-free patients who receive
nucleoside-analogue therapy should have hepatic [liver] function constantly monitored,
especially those with past or present lactic acidaemia."
Carr A et al. Fatal portal hypertension, liver failure, and mitochondrial dysfunction after
HIV-1 nucleoside analogue-induced hepatitis and lactic acidaemia. Lancet. 2001 May 5;357:1412.
"The antiretroviral drugs used to fight HIV, particularly the protease inhibitors, place a
great strain on the liver, the organ whose function it is to metabolize them...When Brian Klein
of San Francisco found out that he was HIV-positive in 1996, he immediately started on a
three-drug regimen that included a protease inhibitor. "Within two weeks I got extremely sick,"
he recalled. "I became jaundiced. I lost 15 pounds. They did some tests, and, lo and behold, I
had hepatitis C [or liver damage from the protease inhibitors generated auto-antibodies
misidentified as from Hepatitis C]. They pulled me off the medications because this was all new
at the time and they didn't know what to do."
Tuller D. Hepatitis C poses new threat to many with AIDS. NY Times. 2001 May 1.
"In 1998-1999, 11 (50%) of 22 deaths were due to end-stage liver disease, compared with 3
(11.5%) of 26 in 1991 and 5 (13.9%) of 36 in 1996 (P = .003). In 1998-1999, 55% of patients had
nondetectable plasma HIV RNA levels and/or CD4 cell counts of >200 cells/mm3 within the year
before death. Most of the patients that were tested had detectable antibodies to hepatitis C
virus (75% of patients who died in 1991, 57.7% who died in 1996, and 93.8% who died in
1998-1999; P = NS). In 1998-1999, 7 patients (31.8%) discontinued antiretroviral therapy
because of hepatotoxicity, compared with 0 in 1991 and 2 (5.6%) in 1996. End-stage liver
disease is now the leading cause of death in our hospitalized HIV-seropositive population."
McGovern B et al. Increasing Mortality Due to End-Stage Liver Disease in Patients with Human
Immunodeficiency Virus Infection. Clin Infect Dis. 2001 Feb 1;32(3):492-497
http://www.journals.uchicago.edu/CID/journal/issues/v32n3/000297/brief/000297.ab
stract.html
.
"We retrospectively examined the causes of death of HIV-seropositive patients at our
institution in 1991, 1996, and 1998-1999. In 1998-1999, 11 (50%) of 22 deaths were due to
end-stage liver disease, compared with 3 (11.5%) of 26 in 1991 and 5 (13.9%) of 36 in 1996.In
1998-1999, 7 patients (31.8%) discontinued antiretroviral therapy because of hepatotoxicity,
compared with 0 in 1991 and 2 (5.6%) in 1996. End-stage liver disease is now the leading cause
of death in our hospitalized HIV-seropositive population."
Bica I et al. Increasing mortality due to end-stage liver disease in patients with human
immunodeficiency virus infection. Clin Infect Dis. 2001 Feb 1;32(3):492-7.
"In a cohort of 1,047 human immunodeficiency virus type 1-infected patients started on protease
inhibitors (PIs), the incidence of severe hepatic [liver] cytolysis (alanine aminotransferase
concentration five times or more above the upper limit of the normal level>=5N) was 5%
patient-years after a mean follow-up of 5 months...At the onset of severe cytolysis, 2 patients
were receiving Saquinavir (SQV), 5...Ritonavir (RTV), 7...Indinavir (IDV), 5...Nelfinavir
(NFV), 1...SQV and RTV, 1...IDV and NFV, and 1...RTV and NFV"
Savès M et al. Hepatitis B or Hepatitis C Virus Infection Is a Risk Factor for Severe Hepatic
Cytolysis after Initiation of a Protease Inhibitor-Containing Antiretroviral Regimen in Human
Immunodeficiency Virus-Infected Patients. Antimicrob Agents Chemother. 2000 Dec;44(12):3451-5
http://aac.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/44/12/3451.
"treatment with certain PIs [Protease Inhibitors] is associated with fat redistribution,
hyperlipidemia (high fat levels in the blood), or both...we examined the effects of PIs on
lipid synthesis in cultured hepatocytes [liver cells] and AKR/J mice. The results showed that
NFV [nelfinavir] and RTV [ritonavir] increased serum TG [triglyceride] levels in
mice...ABT-378, NFV, RTV, and SQV [saquinavir], but not APV [amprenavir] or IDV [indinavir],
increased TG synthesis and RTV increased CH [cholesterol] synthesis in HepG2 [liver]
cells...select PIs affect multiple, distinct metabolic pathways, perhaps accounting for the
different side effects observed for each PI"
Lenhard JM et al. HIV protease inhibitors stimulate hepatic triglyceride synthesis.
Arterioscler Thromb Vasc Biol. 2000 Dec;20:2625-9.
"While the risk of transmission of HIV via a needlestick is approximately 0.3%, the risk of
serious adverse effects of these preventive strategies remains undefined. We report a case of a
health care worker who experienced serious morbidity from PEP [post-exposure prophylaxis]...A
43-year-old female, African American phlebotomist sustained a needlestick injury after drawing
blood from an HIV- and hepatitis C virus (HCV) infected patient. She received PEP with
zidovudine, lamivudine, and nevirapine. Triple therapy including nevirapine was selected based
on the source patient's advanced disease, antiretroviral treatment history, and severity of the
exposure...The patient required an orthotopic liver transplant 35 days following initiation of
PEP. Pathology of the native liver showed confluent hepatic necrosis...We think that this
patient had a severe hypersensitivity reaction to nevirapine that resulted in hepatic
failure...This case raises the question of whether the safety profile of nevirapine warrants
its use as a prophylactic medication in health care workers who are exposed to HIV when the
risk of transmission is low."
Sha BE, Proia LA, Kessler HA. Adverse Effects Associated With Use of Nevirapine in HIV
Postexposure Prophylaxis for 2 Health Care Workers [second case]. JAMA. 2000 Dec
6;284(21):2723.
"The existing sections [of the product label for Nevirapine/Viramune] have been updated to
provide additional warning information about the risk of severe, life-threatening and in some
cases, fatal hepatotoxicity [liver damage] that have been reported in patients treated with
Viramune. Although clinical presentation varied among patients, frequently occurring features
included non-specific prodromal [early] signs and symptoms of fatigue, malaise, anorexia and
nausea, with or without abnormal serum transaminase levels. In these reports, symptoms
progressed to jaundice, hepatomegaly [enlarged liver], elevation of transaminase levels and
hepatic [liver] failure over several days."
Haehl M. Severe, life-threatening and fatal cases of hepatotoxicity with VIRAMUNE. Boehringer
Ingelheim Roxane Laboratories. 2000 Nov.
"Severe hepatotoxicity was observed in 31 (10.4%) of 298 patients...Risk of severe hepatoxicity
was 5-fold higher for patients taking [the protease inhibitor] ritonavir, which accounted for
half of all cases...Likewise, more than half of cases of severe hyperbilirubinemia [excess of
bilirubin] were associated with indinavir use"
Sulkowski MS et al. Hepatotoxicity associated with antiretroviral therapy in adults infected
with Human Immunodeficiency Virus and the role of Hepatitis C or B virus infection. JAMA. 2000
Jan 5;283(1):74-80.
"Liver disease has become the leading cause of death among HIV patients at a Massachusetts
hospital, a report issued on Friday...[by] Dr. Barbara McGovern, a professor at Tufts
University School of Medicine and a member of staff at Lemuel Shattuck Hospital in Jamaica
Plains, Mass. The findings were reported on Friday at the annual meeting of the Infectious
Diseases Society of America in Philadelphia. McGovern said HIV patients who take a powerful
combination of AIDS drugs called highly active antiretroviral therapy (HAART) were at
particular risk because of the drug's potential toxicity to the liver. One-third of HIV
patients with underlying liver disease at Lemuel Shattuck have had to stop taking HAART."
Liver disease raises questions for AIDS patients. Reuters. 1999 Nov 19.
"hepatotoxicity is frequently seen in patients under HAART, and can force the withdrawal of
antiviral treatment in a significant proportion of patients, occasionally resulting in fatal
outcome."
Rodriguez-Rosado R et al. Hepatotoxicity after introduction of highly active antiretroviral
therapy. AIDS. 1998 Jul 9;12(10):1256.
"We analysed the first 187 patients who began highly active antiretroviral therapy (HAART) in a
reference centre for HIV/AIDS located in Madrid. Examination of liver function was made at
baseline and after 1 month of starting treatment.A significant increase in transaminases (more
than twofold) was recognized in 26 (13.9%) patients, whereas bilirubin increases above 2.5 g/l
were seen in seven (3.7%) individuals. Eleven (5.9%) subjects needed to stop the medication
because of either hepatic cytolysis [liver cell death] (nine patients), or hyperbilirubinaemia
(one patient), or both (one patient). Four (2.1%) individuals developed clinical hepatic
decompensation, and one of them died. This patient was receiving stavudine, lamivudine plus
indinavir, and he had been diagnosed with multiple chronic hepatitis (hepatitis B, C and D),
although this was his first episode of clinical liver failure.In conclusion, hepatotoxicity is
frequently seen in patients under HAART, and can force the withdrawal of antiviral treatment in
a significant proportion of patients, occasionally resulting in fatal outcome."
Rodriguez-Rosado R et al. Hepatotoxicity after introduction of highly active antiretroviral
therapy. AIDS. 1998 Jul 9;12(10):1256.
Leave your feedback. We like to hear from you!

© Copyright March 20, 2007 10:05:28 AM: Alberta Reappraising AIDS Society
DavidT - 19 Apr 2007 10:33 GMT
> "DavidT" <david...@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> Alberta Reappraising AIDS Society

This is a dissident web site, so as expected, they try and
misrepresent the truth. There ARE cases of hepatotoxicity from HAART -
I do not dispute this. But by their lopsided reporting of the issue
they are trying to create the impression that AIDS patients are all
dropping like flies because of liver failure from HAART.

The truth is somewhat different, as can be shown by this one quote in
the ARAS site (which they forgot to edit out, presumably):

"Mortality attributable to AIDS decreased from 4.5 to 1.8 per 100
persons per year. Mortality due to liver failure increased from 0.3 to
0.5 per 100 persons per year."

This was in the MACS cohort.

All the data show exactly what I am saying - AIDS mortality has
declined dramatically with introduction of HAART, while liver toxicity
has risen only fractionally. The liver deaths are usually the result
of coinfections of Hep C causing liver failure (because HIV patients
are now living for decades, rather than years) and have little to do
with drug toxicity.
Death - 19 Apr 2007 16:37 GMT
"DavidT" <david199@volcanomail.com> wrote in message
> ...
> All the data show exactly what I am saying - AIDS mortality has
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> are now living for decades, rather than years) and have little to do
> with drug toxicity.

Once again you go from HIV to AIDS and back again as if they were
one-in-the-same.
You use HIV patients to demonstrate that AIDS patients are living longer.

Here is a list you may want to read over:

Drugs that may cause ACUTE DOSE-DEPENDENT LIVER DAMAGE
(resembling acute viral hepatitis)

acetaminophen
salicylates (doses over 2 grams daily)

Drugs that may cause ACUTE DOSE-INDEPENDENT LIVER DAMAGE
(resembling acute viral hepatitis)

acebutolol
indomethacin
phenylbutazone
allopurinol
isoniazid
phenytoin
atenolol
ketoconazole
piroxicam
carbamazepine-
labetalol
probenecid
cimetidine
maprotiline
pyrazinamide
dantrolene
metoprolol
quinidine
diclofenac
mianserin-
quinine
diltiazem
naproxen
ranitidine
enflurane
para-aminosalicylic acid
sulfonamides
ethambutol
penicillins
sulindac-
ethionamide
phenelzine
tricyclic antidepressants
halothane
phenindione
valproic acid
ibuprofen
phenobarbital
verapamil

Drugs that may cause ACUTE FATTY INFILTRATION OF THE LIVER

adrenocortical steroids
phenothiazines
sulfonamides
antithyroid drugs
phenytoin-
tetracyclines
isoniazid
salicylates
valproic acid
methotrexate

Drugs that may cause CHOLESTATIC JAUNDICE

actinomycin D
chlorpropamide
erythromycin
amoxicillin/clavulanate
cloxacillin flecainide
azathioprine
cyclophosphamide
flurazepam
captopril
cyclosporine
flutamide-
carbamazepine
danazol
glyburide
carbimazole
diazepam
gold
cephalosporins
disopyramide
griseofulvin
chlordiazepoxide
enalapril-
enalapril
haloperidol
ketoconazole
norethandrolone
sulfonamides
mercaptopurine
oral contraceptives
tamoxifen
methyltestosterone
oxacillin
thiabendazole-
nifedipine
penicillamine
tolbutamide
nitrofurantoin
phenothiazines
tricyclic antidepressants
nonsteroidal
phenytoin troleandomycin
anti-inflammatory drugs
propoxyphene
verapamil

Drugs that may cause LIVER GRANULOMAS (chronic inflammatory nodules)

allopurinol
gold
phenytoin
aspirin
hydralazine
procainamide
carbamazepine
isoniazid
quinidine
chlorpromazine-
isoniazid
quinidine
chlorpromazine
nitrofurantoin
sulfonamides
diltiazem
penicillin
tolbutamide
disopyramide
phenylbutazone

Drugs that may cause CHRONIC LIVER DISEASE

Drugs that may cause active chronic hepatitis

acetaminophen (chronic use, large doses)
dantrolene
methyldopa
isoniazid
nitrofurantoin

Drugs that may cause liver cirrhosis or fibrosis (scarring)

methotrexate
terbinafine HCI (Lamisil, Sporanox)
nicotinic acid

Drugs that may cause chronic cholestasis (resembling primary biliary cirrhosis)

chlorpromazine/valproic acid (combination)

imipramine
thiabendazole
phenothiazines
tolbutamide
chlorpropamide/erythro-mycin (combination)
phenytoin

Drugs that may cause LIVER TUMORS (benign and malignant)

anabolic steroids
oral contraceptives
thorotrast
danazol
testosterone

Drugs that may cause DAMAGE TO LIVER BLOOD VESSELS

adriamycin
dacarbazine
thioquanine
anabolic steroids
mercaptopurine
vincristine
azathioprine
methotrexate
vitamin A (excessive doses)
carmustine
mitomycin
cyclophosphamide/cyclo-sporine (combination)
oral contraceptives
Death - 18 Apr 2007 16:56 GMT
"DavidT" <david199@volcanomail.com> wrote in message

> Evidence, coming up.......

Kewl

(not that the liver deaths are due to HIV
> exactly, but that they are due to hepatitis coinfection, ...

lol, as I thought. Hiv plus co-infection is AIDS
and not to be confused with medicine induced
liver deaths.
GMCarter - 13 Apr 2007 11:21 GMT
>"...average survival following starting "highly toxic" ART is now 35
>years
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>heard in a very long time.  Where in the world is the evidence for
>this?  

Check out PubMed. Or do a google search. There's ample evidence. Which
you will simply ignore because it doesn't fit your preconceived
notions...which are pretty wacky in general.

Best of luck, dear!
GMCarter - 13 Apr 2007 11:20 GMT
>"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
>>
>> So now you  just make up lies, eh? I am still a member of ACT UP.
>
>Yes, the splintered branch that left act-up over pharma ties.
>Denialism, lol, a wanna-be master of half-truths.

OK--so an anonymous guy just makes stuff up and expects folks will
believe him! Another student of the failed Karl Rove School of Swift
Boat Smearing lies! LOL....

Evidence for any of this nonsense? The only "splinter" group of ACT UP
happened in SF when denialists took over. Now they've all died because
they bought your lies.

        George M. Carter
Death - 18 Apr 2007 17:10 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

> OK--so an anonymous guy just makes stuff up and expects folks will
> believe him! Another student of the failed Karl Rove School of Swift
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> happened in SF when denialists took over. Now they've all died because
> they bought your lies.

No, they died because of perverted faggot sex.

So, you do admit to a "splinter" group?
I'm not quite the liar you wish your-self to believe.
You strengthen my statement of one group going pharma
even after you deny it, lol, see above.

That is mighty faggot of ya Carter.
GMCarter - 19 Apr 2007 11:44 GMT
snip
>No, they died because of perverted faggot sex.

Nope--they died from HIV infection that led to AIDS.

You're lying yet again--but that's no surprise!

Just stay away from Virginia Tech. They don't need any more of your
kind there.
Death - 19 Apr 2007 16:48 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

>  " Death" <Death@yourdoor.net>
> >
> snip
> >No, they died because of perverted faggot sex.
>
> Nope--they died from HIV infection that led to AIDS.

Yep, a direct result of personal behavior, perverted faggot sex.

> You're lying yet again--but that's no surprise!

If that helps you sleep nights, kewl.
Absent the perverted faggot sex, they would not have gotten
HIV infection that led to AIDS.

You continue to cry about drugs, but that comes long after
the behavior that led to AIDS, that being:
sticking your dick in a sh.t-hole or having a dick stuck in yours.
GMCarter - 20 Apr 2007 11:45 GMT
>"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>>
>Yep, a direct result of personal behavior, perverted faggot sex.

Huh...you want to talk about the horrors of lifestyle choices? Of
course, a hideous nasty piece of sh.t like you never has sex, so
perhaps it's moot.

But look at the vile hetero lifestyle! They lie to each other, cheat
on each other, beat, maim and murder each other. They have children
they hate, harm, beat, abandon and kill! They f.ck each other in the
a.s. They eat each other's genitals. They sh.t and urinate on each
other. They do drugs, they drink and smoke and inject things, drop
pills by prescription in the tons--heteros are so vile and disgusting.

One can only hope they'll see the light, turn queer and stop burdening
the planet with so many unwanted and unsupportable children!

Undoubtedly, irony is lost on you.

        George M. Carter
Death - 20 Apr 2007 16:46 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

> Huh...you want to talk about the horrors of lifestyle choices? Of
> course, a hideous nasty piece of sh.t like you never has sex, so
> perhaps it's moot.

lol, poor bitter Killer Karter.
Yes, lets talk about the horrors of lifestyle choices.

> But look at the vile hetero lifestyle! They lie to each other, cheat
> on each other, beat, maim and murder each other. They have children
> they hate, harm, beat, abandon and kill! They f.ck each other in the
> a.s. They eat each other's genitals. They sh.t and urinate on each
> other. They do drugs, they drink and smoke and inject things, drop
> pills by prescription in the tons--heteros are so vile and disgusting.

yep, that is faggots to a tee.

> One can only hope they'll see the light, turn queer and stop burdening
> the planet with so many unwanted and unsupportable children!

Indeed, abort all faggots and aids will die out in one generation.

> Undoubtedly, irony is lost on you.

Not at all. I hope you can say the same.
HIV Positive - 12 Apr 2007 15:01 GMT
>I'm gay. I live in NYC. I joined ACT UP in 1989. I did performance art
>in the 80s. I think that brings me into contact with a lot of at risk
>people.

Well, I think that just goes to prove my point about you befriending
people who are dying.  Or, in this case, those you think are dying.

People involved with ACT UP probably all follow the HIV=AIDS=Death
idea.  Once people have been conditioned to believe they are infected
with a deadly virus and will die, it's hardly surprising the prognosis
comes true.
Signature

URL: http://hiv.positive.googlepages.com/
Moible: +447939991519

DavidT - 12 Apr 2007 10:09 GMT
You clearly haven't been paying attention for the last decade or so.
What makes you think all doctors subscribe to the HIV=AIDS=Death
concept? This is something the denialists have been saying, but please
show us some evidence that it is the prevailing dogma as you say it
is.
Links to orthodox medical sites would do.
I won't hold my breath

FYI, not everyone with HIV may necessarily go on to develop AIDS, for
a variety of reasons. And not everyone with AIDS may die from it -
average survival following starting "highly toxic" ART is now 35 years
(as compared to survival of less than 2 years without ART).
rocketscience - 12 Apr 2007 14:38 GMT
> You clearly haven't been paying attention for the last decade or so.
> What makes you think all doctors subscribe to the HIV=AIDS=Death
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> average survival following starting "highly toxic" ART is now 35 years
> (as compared to survival of less than 2 years without ART).

Yes that is correct, not only people are living 35 year with HIV.

They are doing it on NO DRUGS.

The HIV drugs are poisons and cause a list of adverse side effects
leading to liver failure.

HIV drugs are a form of iatrogenic genocide.  The HIV drugs
(intentionally or not) such as AZT

eliminated a segment of the population considered as "undesirebale",
namely IV drug addicts, minority groups and

homosexuals like your partner, Carter.

see this video:

http://www.hiv-aids-factorfraud.com/

http://aidsmyth.addr.com/enteraidsmyth.htm

We are a global-reach voluntary group. Our goal is ensuring the
interests of AIDS-diagnosed people are no longer secondary to the
interests of drug suppliers, service providers and the AIDS research
industry.

Did You Know that many experts now contend AIDS is not a fatal,
incurable condition caused by HIV?

We bring you the voices of alternative scientists and reforming
campaigners worldwide.  We are independent of vested pharmaceutical
and medical interests -offering readers and forum members, global
news
and leading edge views on diagnosis and treatment.

Most of the information you receive is commercially driven and based
on misleading assumptions or unfounded estimates and predictions. The
symptoms associated with AIDS are treatable using non-toxic, immune
enhancing therapies that have restored health and have enabled those
truly at risk to remain well.

rocketscience
RJ - 13 Apr 2007 16:00 GMT
> http://aidsmyth.addr.com/enteraidsmyth.htm
>
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> rocketscience

I notice you have a link there for Continuum. Continuum is no longer
published because Huw Christie and Jody Wells died of AIDS. Why
weren't their symptoms treatable? Why did they not remain well? Any
ideas?
DavidT - 13 Apr 2007 18:25 GMT
> I notice you have a link there for Continuum. Continuum is no longer
> published because Huw Christie and Jody Wells died of AIDS. Why
> weren't their symptoms treatable? Why did they not remain well? Any
> ideas?

They never took toxic antiretrovirals either, did they? And here was
me thinking that NOT taking drugs if you were HIV positive was a sure
fire way of living forever.
;)
rocketscience - 14 Apr 2007 09:23 GMT
> >http://aidsmyth.addr.com/enteraidsmyth.htm
>
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Why did you kill Arthur Ashe and 250,000 countless others with AZT?

Anti-HIV drugs are highly toxic poisons which esentially eliminate the
IV drug addicts, homosexuals and the minority groups from society.

Anti-HIV drugs =  iatrogenic genocide.

rocketscience
GMCarter - 14 Apr 2007 10:58 GMT
snip
>Why did you kill Arthur Ashe and 250,000 countless others with AZT?

AZT monotherapy sucked and some of us knew it at the time.

AIDS killed Arthur Ashe and countless others. Most people die from
AIDS without ever seeing ARV.

Why do you persist in lying?
RJ - 15 Apr 2007 01:10 GMT
On Apr 14, 4:23 am, "rocketscience" <rocketscience13...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> > >http://aidsmyth.addr.com/enteraidsmyth.htm
>
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
>
> rocketscience

Standard tactic - can't answer the question so throw out one of your
own. If HIV drugs really do what you're saying, why do so few people
die or experience toxicity during long term follow up in trials? Why
did people in the SMART study that interrupted therapy do worse than
those that continued (all of the >5,000 people in that study had been
on ARVs for an average of six years prior to even joining the trial -
what was that about toxic poison?).

Where did you get that 250,000 figure by the way? Have you seen the
IMS data for the number of AZT scrips that were filled in the time
period you're referring to? Hint: it is not compatible with the number
you picked up from some denialist website.
rocketscience - 15 Apr 2007 18:01 GMT
> On Apr 14, 4:23 am, "rocketscience" <rocketscience13...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

How long have you been working for the drug industry?
DavidT - 16 Apr 2007 09:25 GMT
On 15 Apr, 18:01, "rocketscience" <rocketscience13...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> > On Apr 14, 4:23 am, "rocketscience" <rocketscience13...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 57 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

LOL- I quote RJ again - "Standard tactic - can't answer the question
so throw out one of your own."
GMCarter - 16 Apr 2007 11:32 GMT
snip
>> How long have you been working for the drug industry?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>LOL- I quote RJ again - "Standard tactic - can't answer the question
>so throw out one of your own."

And an ad hominem one at that. Typoical Frodlet/Rove activity.

On the other hand, I cannot recommend strongly enough that people read
"The Truth About the Drug Companies" by Marcia Angell, MD. Excellent
book. Refutes lies such as that it costs $800 million to bring a drug
to market.

Thanks for the research on CD4 count variability, David. That was
interesting.

        George M. Carter
Death - 18 Apr 2007 17:30 GMT
"GMCarter" <fiar@verizon.net> wrote in message

> On the other hand, I cannot recommend strongly enough that people read
> "The Truth About the Drug Companies" by Marcia Angell, MD. Excellent
> book. Refutes lies such as that it costs $800 million to bring a drug
> to market.

That you would want drugs placed on the market quick-time
is not in question.

The epidemic of AZT and other anti-HIV/AIDS medications

4.1. DNA terminators licensed as a cure. In 1987 the American and European illicit drug
epidemic had been joined by a new epidemic of toxic legal drugs, the DNA chain-terminators,
such as AZT, that are prescribed to hundreds of thousands of HIV-positives together with a
litany of other orthodox and unorthodox anti-HIV/AIDS drugs (see 4.2. and Table 7). In America
AZT was licensed in record time as an antiviral drug in 1987 by the Food and Drug
Administration (FDA) based on studies conducted by its sister institutions from the Department
of HHS, the National Cancer Institute 147 and the NIAID 148 together with the drug's
manufacturer Burroughs Wellcome.

The fast approval of AZT" despite its inherent toxicity" was a major coup of AIDS researchers
149. By going public more aggressively than any other scientists before, American AIDS
researchers from the NIAID, NCI and CDC had mobilized patients, homosexual AIDS risk groups and
journalists to demand protection from the predicted AIDS explosion at any cost. As a result of
this pressure the FDA and AIDS researchers fast-tracked first the approval of AZT and then that
of ever-more untested anti-HIV/AIDS drugs 150. Surprisingly, all of these drugs were eagerly
welcomed by the medical and public press and above all by unsuspecting AIDS patients. The
politics behind the approval of AZT first by the FDA and the American medical orthodoxy, and
then by the rest of the world has been described in two recent books, Good intentions 151 and
Inventing the AIDS Virus 11.

AZT and other DNA chain-terminators are now used both as AIDS prophylaxis and therapy in the
hope that they will terminate HIV DNA synthesis without terminating cell DNA synthesis 152.
However, there are several problems with this optimistic plan:

1) The licensing study conducted in 1986 by the National Cancer Institute (NCI) and Burroughs
Wellcome had erroneously underestimated the toxicity of AZT for human cells a 1000-fold 147!
Although at least 7 independent studies have since pointed out this 1000-fold error 153-159,
the recommended prescription dose has only been reduced 3-fold, from 1.5 g of AZT per day in
1987 to 0.5 g now 160, 161.

2) The initial success of the American clinical licensing study conducted by the NIAID and
Burroughs Wellcome, that claimed a 19-fold reduced AIDS-mortality 148, could not be reproduced
by numerous independent studies from other countries, including the UK 162, France 163, The
Netherlands 164, Australia 165, and also not by an independent American study that was not
suppo