Medical Forum / Diseases and Disorders / AIDS / January 2006
happy new year
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wilyretrovirus - 01 Jan 2006 15:47 GMT Here's hoping everybody here has a good new year, even if their HIV/AIDS house of cards comes tumbling down.
wilyretrovirus - 01 Jan 2006 16:07 GMT Being the first to post here for the new year, I'll take that as a very, very good sign of things to come.
Death - 10 Jan 2006 18:30 GMT "wilyretrovirus" <purfling@nospam.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> Being the first to post here for the new year, I'll take that as a very, > very good sign of things to come. Being the first to post here shows you had no life. Indeed a sign of things to come.
Gary Stein - 01 Jan 2006 17:07 GMT > Here's hoping everybody here has a good new year, even if their HIV/AIDS > house of cards comes tumbling down. I also wish everyone a productive and joyful new year full of good health and cheer.
However being as you denialists are the ones living in straw houses I predict it is your homes that will be blown down and the brick houses of the mainstream will continue to stand and even grow over the new year.
Gary Stein
wilyretrovirus - 01 Jan 2006 21:15 GMT "I predict it is your homes that will be blown down and the brick houses of the mainstream will continue to stand and even grow over the new year."
I doubt it, Gary. Funding and donations for "AIDS" are on a steady decline. I hear AIDS organizations bemoaning this fact constantly.
Your bloated beast requires incredible amounts of money and fear to keep it alive. The money is slowly drying up, and the fear campaigns are backfiring as well. You're going to need a lot more "superstrain" scares to keep your monster alive. Your "team" is running out of options, Gary.
Maybe the "success" of ARV's is your own undoing. People are becoming less and less afraid of "HIV". Gay men are nearly laissez-faire these days about "HIV" infection.
Look at the "poz" websites. Glossy, slick, great media presentations...where's the fear factor? Oops, you guys forgot to include it. Yes, the "success" of "treatments" makes "HIV" infection look quite manageable. You boys better get busy injecting more fear into people (George is pretty good at that). Your "HIV" monster requires fear to stay alive.
I disagree with you, Gary. Your house of card will most definitely come down. It's just a matter of how soon.
Gary Stein - 02 Jan 2006 20:53 GMT > "I predict it is your homes that will be blown down and the brick houses > of [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > I disagree with you, Gary. Your house of card will most definitely come > down. It's just a matter of how soon. Your side has been making that prediction for 20 years always saying the end is just a short time away. Well you've been consistently wrong for 20 years I don't see that changing anytime soon.........................
Gary Stein
wilyretrovirus - 02 Jan 2006 22:32 GMT > I disagree with you, Gary. Your house of card will most definitely come > down. It's just a matter of how soon. Your side has been making that prediction for 20 years always saying the end is just a short time away. Well you've been consistently wrong for 20 years I don't see that changing anytime soon.........................
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Well, Gary,
until the day your house of cards comes crashing down (and it will)...if you find yourself needing to supplement your income, I bet the folks at ICC could use a little help pouring toxic drugs into gastric tubes surgically-implanted into kids' abdomens. Why stop at vague mentions of "providing health care" for HIV-negative Charlie Scovill? Why not go and help where you can really make a difference?
Go on! Give them a hand! You'll feel REALLY good about yourself. Just keep repeating the immortal words of the brilliant Dr. David Ho, "it's the virus, stupid", as you're pouring drugs into childrens' bodies against their will. Try not to think about Aushwitz...it would be a total bummer. Instead, just keep remembering your "HIV" heroes...Ho, Fauci, Gallo, Montagnier, Bennett, Noble.
Iconoclaster - 03 Jan 2006 01:20 GMT Yes, all good and well, Wily. But I'm really concerned about these guys. Pretty soon they won't be able to make a living anymore. I think their best bet is to take a retooling course in "Bird Flu Finagling" Fortunately, they're still in good standing with the pharma companies, so maybe they'll be willing to fund these educational programs.
montygram - 04 Jan 2006 00:29 GMT Gary Stein is finally correct about something! Social myths are quite resilient, even when they are demonstrably ludicrous, as is the case with "HIV/AIDS." For the New Year, I will renew my offer to take my version of the "Duesberg Challenge." Gary, are you interested? If you don't like my version of it, perhaps we could negotiate something you would be comfortable with, though considering how you don't want to deal with the scientific reality, I'm not holding out much hope.
Still, I am here, patiently waiting for someone to take me up on the offer.
wilyretrovirus - 04 Jan 2006 00:56 GMT "Gary Stein is finally correct about something! Social myths are quite resilient, even when they are demonstrably ludicrous, as is the case with "HIV/AIDS." For the New Year, I will renew my offer to take my version of the "Duesberg Challenge." Gary, are you interested? If you don't like my version of it, perhaps we could negotiate something you would be comfortable with, though considering how you don't want to deal with the scientific reality, I'm not holding out much hope.
Still, I am here, patiently waiting for someone to take me up on the offer."
Montygram,
I'd have no trouble taking the "Duesberg challenge" as well.
The absurd, insidious nature of this institutionalized medical genocide against gay men, blacks, women, asians, anybody but white heterosexual males, really...makes for a "guilty until proven innocent" situation for me as a gay man. So...there's another reason I doubt anybody would take me up on it, besides the problem of obtaining "pure HIV".
Gary Stein - 04 Jan 2006 03:00 GMT > "Gary Stein is finally correct about something! Social myths are quite > resilient, even when they are demonstrably ludicrous, as is the case [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > me as a gay man. So...there's another reason I doubt anybody would take > me up on it, besides the problem of obtaining "pure HIV". Well being as you have defined what you will accept as HIV (for injection purposes) in your challenge in a way that you assume no one can meet your challenge is nothing but hot air.
If I am mistaken in this please list for us which of the following you would find acceptable for your experiment or if none of those listed bellow provide a definition of what you will accept.
Here are some options;
1. 100 cc's of blood from an HIV positive heterosexual person who is not on ARV and who has not abused drugs or poppers in the past.
2. 100 cc's of Cloned HIV from a reputable laboratory.
3. 100 cc's of cultured HIV from a reputable laboratory.
4. 100 cc's of stored blood plasma that was documented to have infected a person with HIV from the time before the blood supply was tested for the HIV virus. Though I don't know if any of those blood plasma samples from the early 1980's have been stored or if the HIV would still be viable I would have to consult Bennett on that question.
5. 100 cc's of my blood.
Now if your convinced in the non-existence or harmlessness of HIV I fail to understand why you need the monetary part of your challenge. I would think just proving the evil mainstream wrong would be payment enough for you.
If I was you I would change the challenge such that if you do become infected then your fellow denialists will guarantee to cover the cost of all your HIV medical care and if you do not become infected you will be amply rewarded financially by the book deals and lecture circuit that will open up to you.
Gary Stein
wilyretrovirus - 04 Jan 2006 01:07 GMT I forgot to add Mexican migrant farm workers to the previous list. Yep, it was on NPR yesterday (National Propaganda Radio), so it MUST be true. Those Mexicans must be screwing like bunnies!
"AIDS" is racism! It seems ANYBODY other than heterosexual white males get "HIV/AIDS". Still have yet to meet my very first white male heterosexual deemed "HIV positive".
Gary Stein - 04 Jan 2006 02:59 GMT > Gary Stein is finally correct about something! Social myths are quite > resilient, even when they are demonstrably ludicrous, as is the case [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Still, I am here, patiently waiting for someone to take me up on the > offer. Well being as you have defined what you will accept as HIV (for injection purposes) in your challenge in a way that you assume no one can meet your challenge is nothing but hot air.
If I am mistaken in this please list for us which of the following you would find acceptable for your experiment or if none of those listed bellow provide a definition of what you will accept.
Here are some options;
1. 100 cc's of blood from an HIV positive heterosexual person who is not on ARV and who has not abused drugs or poppers in the past.
2. 100 cc's of Cloned HIV from a reputable laboratory.
3. 100 cc's of cultured HIV from a reputable laboratory.
4. 100 cc's of stored blood plasma that was documented to have infected a person with HIV from the time before the blood supply was tested for the HIV virus. Though I don't know if any of those blood plasma samples from the early 1980's have been stored or if the HIV would still be viable I would have to consult Bennett on that question.
5. 100 cc's of my blood.
Now if your convinced in the non-existence or harmlessness of HIV I fail to understand why you need the monetary part of your challenge. I would think just proving the evil mainstream wrong would be payment enough for you.
If I was you I would change the challenge such that if you do become infected then your fellow denialists will guarantee to cover the cost of all your HIV medical care and if you do not become infected you will be amply rewarded financially by the book deals and lecture circuit that will open up to you.
Gary Stein
Susie, age 9 - 05 Jan 2006 16:08 GMT > 5. 100 cc's of my blood. A vampire would shun your blood, Mr. Stein.
Poisoned.
susie
montygram - 06 Jan 2006 03:06 GMT "cloned HIV" ?
I don't see any problem with this for the "challenge." Small amounts of foreign proteins, or proteins that are coming into contact with blood that should not (for example, what produces "anti-nuclear antibodies") will not cause "AIDS." However, massive amounts of foreign proteins can cause the Th1 to Th2 shift found in many "HIV/AIDS" patients. Thus, I would propose a suppository made of coconut oil and the "cloned HIV." That should ensure "infection." Now, if you are not familiar with my version of the challenge, you pay me the current cost of the full "HIV cocktail" drugs, and that money will be put in escrow. If I am dead within 15 years of one of the "AIDS indicator diseases" that is currently on the CDC's list, you get all the money back, plus the interest, plus all my assets, but if I'm still alive I get to keep it.
Is it a go?
GMCarter - 06 Jan 2006 12:33 GMT >"cloned HIV" ? > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >foreign proteins can cause the Th1 to Th2 shift found in many >"HIV/AIDS" patients. Wow. You're f.cking too stupid to breathe, ain't ya?
Iconoclaster - 12 Jan 2006 01:37 GMT Mr. Carter, why must your comments always be so dumb?
wilyretrovirus - 12 Jan 2006 02:15 GMT I think it's a quality vs. quantity issue. Quantity seems to be the winner.
Death - 12 Jan 2006 17:02 GMT "wilyretrovirus" <purfling@nospam.yahoo.com> wrote in message
> I think it's a quality vs. quantity issue. Quantity seems to be the > winner. Female AIDS patients 'beaten with electric batons' in China Jan 12 10:33 AM US/Eastern
Two Chinese women with HIV/AIDS were beaten by police with electric batons after demanding the release of a fellow hospital patient arrested for complaining about his stipend.
The women were left with bruises on their bodies after the incident at the People's Hospital in Dehui city, Jilin province, witnesses and a rights group said Thursday.
The three were among 25 people infected with HIV when the hospital used unsafe and unscreened blood for transfusions in 2003, according to the Beijing-based AIDS rights group Aizhixing Institute.
The hospital had agreed to treat them and pay them a daily stipend of 15 yuan (nearly two dollars) after infecting them.
However on Wednesday the patients had failed to receive the money for two days, and Liu Bingzhu demanded to see the director.
When the director refused to see him, Liu switched off the hospital's electricity in anger and officials called the police.
Liu was arrested by about 30 riot police who also beat the female patients when they complained.
About 10 of the patients on Thursday submitted a petition to the provincial legislature in Changchun city demanding Liu's release and punishment for the riot police.
"What they did was illegal. They're discriminating against patients," said one of the group, Wang Shuhong, who also called for the patients to be transferred to another hospital.
"We got this disease from this hospital. How can they make us stay here? How can we have confidence in the treatment?"
Six health officials in Dehui were stripped of their posts or placed on probation over the infections, state media had reported.
Thousands of people were believed to have been infected with HIV/AIDS by transfusions and unscreened blood, and many victims do not know they are carrying the disease.
montygram - 06 Jan 2006 03:52 GMT As the Perth Group points out:
In the very first electron micrograph (published in May 1983), Barré-Sinoussi, Montagnier et al not only immediately identified some particles as retrovirus particles but they stated that: "Electron microscopy of the infected umbilical cord lymphocytes showed characteristic immature particles with dense crescent (C-type) budding at the plasma membrane...This virus is a typical type-C RNA tumor virus". In 1984 Montagnier, Barre-Sinoussi et al reported that their virus was "morphologically similar to D particles such as those found in Mason-Pfizer virus or the virus recently isolated from simian AIDS." (By 1984 researchers from the primate research centres in the United States claimed the existence of AIDS in monkeys and that the cause of AIDS was a type-D retrovirus similar to the Mason-Pfizer virus, a typical type-D retrovirus and suggested that the monkey AIDS and these retroviruses could be helpful in the study of human AIDS and "HIV"). In the same year, in yet another publication, Montagnier et al claimed that the "HIV" particles had "morphology similar to that of equine infectious anaemia virus (EIAV), and D type particles". The EIAV and the visna virus are neither type C nor type D retroviruses but lentiviruses, that is, viruses which have different morphology and said to induce diseases long after infection. (By the time this paper was published it was realised that patients who had a positive "HIV" antibody test did not develop AIDS immediately, that is, there was a delay between the positive test and the appearance of AIDS). It is most astonishing that the one and the same virus is able to change genus from a typical type-C to a typical type-D particle and then to a completely different subfamily, namely a typical lentivirus, apparently at will and according to non-morphological criteria. These taxonomical differences imply that if HIV was a newly discovered mammal, it could have been either human, or a gorilla or an orang-utan.
All this aside, you have not answered my question. Even if Montagnier had electron micrographs typical of retroviruses, they were all from the culture. As Montagnier acknowledged, no retroviruses were seen at the 1.16g/ml band. What I am interested in is how can anybody take some proteins and RNA from the 1.16g/ml band where there are no proof of any retrovirus-like particles and call them "HIV proteins" and "HIV RNA"?
Source: http://www.virusmyth.net/aids/data/vtcorweiss.htm
"Modern medicine," and to a large degree "biology" as well, is quite an amazing disaster, demonstrating many human failings, such as "goup think." Some good work was done 100 or so years ago, then in the middle of the twentieth century, the "bug hunters" and the "epidemiologists" began to ignore the undeniable evidence that the "bugs" only cause problems under certain conditions, which are usually present in "un-natural,""civilized" societies (or those that have been exploited by "civilized" peoples, then left "high and dry" at some point, like many places in Africa).
If you are an "AIDS patient," Gary, I have no doubt I could "cure" you, unless your body has already broken down so that you look like the guy in the film Silverlake Life (Tom Joslin?) towards the end of his life. If I had not seen such a recovery for myelf, I too would have trouble believing it. But you would need to trust the scientific method, rather than the current social myths, and most people are just not intellectually and/or emotionally capable of doing this. You would have to get back to basics: known human physiology, and work from there, not trusting what someone who has power says just because he/she is an "expert." The "HIV/AIDS" claim does not rise to the level of B-movie science fiction, but for some reason, it is often the case that the bigger the lie, the more difficult it is for people to see it for what it is, perhaps because we can't tolerate the notion that our "leaders" and "experts" are incompetent, self-interested, etc., though in light of recent poltical events, one would think that more people would now "wake up and smell the coffee" about "HIV/AIDS." Perhaps that is in fact happening, just not in a dramatic way.
In any case, I'm more than willing to be exposed to a little cellular debris called "HIV," and I would not allow "doctors" to "help" me, unless I understood and approved of what they were doing. I would not take "anti-virals," "anti-biotics," or "vaccines" under any conditions, nor would I subject myself to "chemo-therapy." My cholesterol level is "high," I eat plenty of "saturated fat," salt, chocolate, and sugar, and I avoid more than the tiniest trace amounts of "essential fatty acids," According to the "experts," if infected with "HIV," I should not last long at all, so someone like yourself should be more than willing to take me up on my offer. You will actually make more than a small sum of money if you are correct, as well as feel vindicated in the notion that you are doomed by "HIV."
GMCarter - 04 Jan 2006 11:38 GMT Gary Stein is correct about something! Social myths are quite resilient, even when they are demonstrably ludicrous, as is the case with "denialists."
Susie, age 9 - 04 Jan 2006 20:42 GMT >> Here's hoping everybody here has a good new year, even if their HIV/AIDS >> house of cards comes tumbling down. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > predict it is your homes that will be blown down and the brick houses of > the mainstream will continue to stand and even grow over the new year. Silly. Gary Stein should know that in the first few decades of any disease, the "mainstream" is always wrong.
susie
GMCarter - 05 Jan 2006 11:25 GMT snip
>Silly. Gary Stein should know that in the first few decades of any disease, >the "mainstream" is always wrong. What a remarkable and wholly unsupported comment!
No surprise, considering the source.
George M. Carter
Susie, age 9 - 05 Jan 2006 16:06 GMT > snip >>Silly. Gary Stein should know that in the first few decades of any >>disease, >>the "mainstream" is always wrong. > > What a remarkable and wholly unsupported comment! Indeed, the History of Medicine.
Too bad you don't know it, George Mohammed.
susie
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